November 22, 2019 at 10:43 AM #29764
Hi! New to this forum.
I recently acquired an OSSC 1.6, a RetroTINK 2X and a Framemeister (the latter I got for only about $199US – I kid you not!). I have not yet integrated them into my gaming setup. But I have a SCART amplifier which I’m planning on using to split video to all of these devices. For the longest time I’ve used one these SCART to HDMI converters.
In fact, I’ve frequently recommended the cheap device over the Framemeister because of how seamlessly it handles resolutions switches over SCART. The Framemeister blacks out for several seconds when a game changes from 288p to 576i for example. In my case this is very problematic, because MOST of my favourite PS1 games not only have this resolution switch issue but also glitch up on the PS3.
The OSSC seems to have this 288p/576i blackout issue too, but it gets the picture back sooner. The RetroTINK 2X is a rather interesting case. I’ve been doing some tests with my PS2’s component cables and AV/S-video breakout adapter. Over component video, the RetroTINK also blacks out, even with the linedoubled mode enabled – in fact when the blackout occurs it sounds like it blew the speakers too. But over S-video with the 2x mode enabled, the transition is seamless.
I think is a new discovery. I haven’t seen anyone else talk about this in forums or videos. Even My Life In Gaming reported having blackouts with this device, however I think they were only testing component. There is definitely NO blackout over S-video on the RetroTINK when in linedouble mode. I’ve tested Driver on the PS1 over S-video and Star Wars Rogue Squadron on the N64 over S-video. Neither blacked out with 2X mode on. With passthrough obviously there was a blackout.
At the time of my writing I haven’t done any capture tests to see how S-video on the RetroTINK compares to RGB on the cheap SCART device or OSSC or Framemeister. Though eyeballing it looks almost as good if not identical to RGB. I’ll try and post some capture tests next week. So this could be a huge solution for people suffering from resolution switches. The PlayStation has a breakout S-video adapter that can used regardless of what main cables you use. And unless you mod it, the N64 maxes out at S-video. Not sure how Sega Saturn fans would benefit from it. I’m aware of no S-video breakout cables so it’d be a choice between RGB or S-video, unless you have an RGB to S-video transcoder.
November 22, 2019 at 4:33 PM #29772
- This topic was modified 1 week, 4 days ago by Jarrah White.
To clarify, those blackouts are a product of mode switching over HDMI. Those cheap scalers survive, because they perform framerate conversion and scaling to a specific resolution, so they would likely also black out if they simply digitized the incoming signals.
I find it unlikely that S-Video over the RT2X doesn’t suffer the same, but, if that’s actually the case, it would be a pleasant surprise, and I think the community would be interested in understanding precisely why that happens with S-Video and not composite or YPbPr.November 26, 2019 at 2:33 PM #29803
RetroTINK does black out on transitions on all but a handful of cases.
The cheap converters do a frame rate conversion and also handle 240p as 480i resulting in a less than stellar image that suffers from scroll judder, but if avoiding the blackout is the most important consideration they can be preferable.November 26, 2019 at 3:01 PM #29804
Which games had the transition blackout on the RetroTINK? I finished my exams this morning, so I’ll upload some capture tests of the RetroTINK’s handing over S-video this week. The blackout is definitely non-existent over S-video with the 2x mode on. At least with the games I tested.
About the cheap converter, I’ve personally never had any issues with judder. The image is certainly not as distinct as the OSSC or Framemeister, but I think it holds up pretty well against them. The mishandling of 288p is practically a non-issue if you’re feeding it interlaced PS2 or OG Xbox or other sixth gen content.
But if the RetroTINK’s seamless resolution switching in 2x mode over S-video is common, gamers may no longer need make a choice between accurate 240p/288p upscaling and avoiding blackouts during resolution changes.
November 26, 2019 at 5:11 PM #29806
- This reply was modified 1 week ago by Jarrah White.
Even if the RT2X does somehow do seamless transitions with S-Video input, it’s still not going to be a perfect solution for everyone, especially those who’ve invested in RGB/SCART and/or OSSC setups; and we still need to figure out why it happens. It may be something like a bug in the firmware on your unit that causes S-Video to always be treated like 480i, or some quirk of the RT2X and your specific model TV/monitor that may not be replicable with other setups.November 26, 2019 at 10:22 PM #29813
It may be something like a bug in the firmware on your unit that causes S-Video to always be treated like 480i, or some quirk of the RT2X and your specific model TV/monitor that may not be replicable with other setups.
I don’t think the RetroTINK is mishandling the input. The only way I was able to get my TV to display any PS1 resolutions through either the RetroTINK or even the OSSC was by feeding their outputs into the HDMI input on either the cheapbox mentioned above or the Framemeister. Whereas the cheap box’s SCART input interlaces everything, it’s HDMI input correctly detects the resolution and displays a little on screen notification labeling them as such. But ironically like the Framemeister, the cheapbox blacks out momentarily whenever it detects a resolution change over HDMI. I demonstrated an example of such in this video using the PS2 to HDMI.
With the RetroTINK set to 2x mode, the cheap box’s on screen message specifically says 576p regardless of whether the former is line-doubling 288p or bob-deinterlacing 576i. But with the RetroTINK set to passthrough, the cheap box’s onscreen notification specifically says either 288p or 576i and blacks out when it detects a change. Will post videos shortly.
November 27, 2019 at 4:53 AM #29815
- This reply was modified 6 days, 23 hours ago by Jarrah White.
Maybe it’s some weird condition where the line-doubled 288p and 576i end up having the same refresh rate? And that only happens over S-Video? Even using composite or YPbPr from the same console results in blackouts?November 27, 2019 at 5:04 AM #29816
I haven’t tested composite. Only S-video and YPbPr. YPbPr blacks out even in linedoubled mode, S-video doesn’t.December 2, 2019 at 2:00 PM #29869
As promised, here is my demonstration.
A clarification from before. It seems the PlayStation TWO console has the blackout issue. Whereas S-video on the original PLayStation has no blackouts when the RetroTINK is in 2x mode.
- This reply was modified 1 day, 8 hours ago by Jarrah White.
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